Clarkston Sunshine

Introduction:

Links to the video recording and the council packet are at the bottom of this post. Please note any errors or omissions in the comments. Anything noted in brackets was inserted by Clarkston Sunshine.

Agenda Item #1, Call to Order (video time mark 0:00:02):

Sue Wylie said OK, it’s 7:00, so I’m calling the meeting to order.

Agenda Item #2, Pledge of Allegiance (video time mark 0:00:05):

Wylie said if everybody would please rise, we will say the Pledge of Allegiance.

(Pledge said.)

Wylie said thank you.

Agenda Item #3, Roll Call (video time mark 0:00:29):

Wylie said our third item is a roll call, and [to Angela Guillen, clerk] if you would take the roll call please.

Wylie, Rodgers, Avery, Casey, Jones, and Quisenberry were present.

Forte was absent.

Wylie said OK, thank you.

Agenda Item #4, Approval of Agenda – Motion (video time mark 0:00:45):

Wylie said Item #4 is approval of the agenda. I’ll need a motion to approve the agenda.

Motion by Jones; second Rodgers.

Wylie said discussion from council members?

No comments.

Wylie said from the public?

No comments.

Motion to approve the agenda passed by unanimous voice vote.

Wylie said the agenda is approved.

Agenda Item #5, Public Comments (video time mark 0:01:05):

[Though public comments can sometimes irritate the city council, there is value to both the council and the public in hearing them. While they can’t eliminate public comments entirely without violating the Open Meetings Act, your city council has occasionally decided not to acknowledge public comments during a city council meeting unless the person submitting the comments also appears at the meeting (in-person or electronically) to personally read them. In the past, members of the public have been cut off for exceeding the city council’s arbitrary three-minute time limit (it’s arbitrary because no time limits are required by the Open Meetings Act).

If your public comments were submitted to the council but not read, or if you tried to make public comments but your comments were cut short, please email them to clarkstonsunshine@gmail.com and I will include them in my informal meeting summaries either under public comments or under the specific agenda item that you want to speak to.]

Wylie said Item #5 is public comments.

(Wylie read the rules for public comments.)

Wylie said would anybody like to make public comment?

No comments.

Wylie said OK.

Agenda Item #6 – FYI: (video time mark 0:01:32):

Item #6a – Clarkston Ghost Walk – October 17^th

• • Downtown Clarkston Ghost Walk Flyer (page 3/51 of the city council packet)

Wylie said move on to Item #6, which is FYI. There’s a Clarkson Ghost Walk October 17th. The event runs from 6:00 to 9:00 p.m. Ticket check-in is from 6:00 to 7:30 p.m. Visit Ludus, that’s ludus.com and type in Clarkston Historical Society to purchase your tickets. Adults are $18, and it’s a spooky night of spooky history and great stories. Self-guided tour starts upstairs at the Union Woodshop Restaurant. From there, you’ll be directed to the homes and buildings in town that are inhabited by more than the living. Our on-site storytellers will reveal to you exactly what paranormal activity is happening at each place. Once you finish the tour, head back to the Woodshop shop for the free snack included in your ticket price. Don’t forget to stop at the ghost walk photo booth for complimentary souvenir, and it says warning some stories may be disturbing to children under 10.

Wylie said does anybody else have anything for FYI?

(Avery made an unintelligible comment.)

Agenda Item #7 – City Manager’s Report (video time mark 0:02:38):

• • 10-12-2026 City Manager Report (page 4/51 of the council packet)

Wylie said next on our agenda is Item #7. It’s a city manager’s report. We have a pretty extensive city manager’s report. (To Jonathan Smith, city manager), Wylie said did you want to discuss anything?

Smith said a couple of things I’d like to touch on. First and foremost, the Police, Fire and Emergency Services millage proposal. We have the proposal in a PowerPoint form which gives background on why this is needed and that is available on our website. It’s available in the city lobby, city hall lobby. We’ve also recorded a version. I hate the way I sound on it, but it is nonetheless a recorded version that is available to our residents to listen to. It just basically walks through and gives some additional details behind each slide as to why, why this is needed. Gerry Fisher (city attorney) said where is it available? Smith said it’s on the city website and it’s on Facebook as well. Fisher said OK. Smith said the video presentation. So, if you are encountering people who have questions about the millage and why this is necessary, I strongly encourage you to direct them to the website or to our Facebook site where you can watch the recording. We’re also having a second in-person meeting coming up next Wednesday, a week from this Wednesday, October 21^st. I’ll be right here in the conference room, and I’ll be going through the presentation live and it’s an opportunity for people to ask questions live in person.

Wylie said what time is the presentation on Wednesday, the 21^st? Smith said 7:00 p.m. Wylie said thank you.

Casey said how are we going to publicize that? Smith said we have it on our website. I will be putting it in my weekly email distribution as well. We’ve been trying to get the word out on Facebook as well. We’re trying to get the word out about these events. If people have questions about the millage, please look it up online. I appeal to the council to help with this initiative, to try to get the word out about the importance of this. My fear is that we’re not getting enough word out fast enough just to educate the residents. What direction they vote is up to them, of course, but we’re trying to get the word out to give them all the facts behind it.

Fisher said did you want me to mention the other possibility that – Smith said yes, yes. We’ve talked about the possibility of doing something a little bit more forthcoming. Maybe I didn’t say the right word, but to put an ad in the paper or something that’s doable. Fisher said that is doable. It’s got to be factual. It can’t be advocacy, but it’s got, if it’s factual, it’s OK. So, you have a broad prohibition in the statute, but subject to the prohibition on radio, television, mass mailing or pre-recorded message, which that is, none of them encompass the, putting an ad in the paper. And subject to that, the production, dissemination of factual information concerning issues relevant to the function of the public body is fair game. Smith said OK.

Smith said so, what about the payment for that ad? Where can those funds come from? Fisher said that can come from the city, yeah. Smith said OK, from municipal funds. That’s, that’s all I’m questioning. Fisher said there’s a prohibition on using funds, generally, but this is a prohibition, where the general prohibition doesn’t apply. Smith said OK. So, is that something that council would like us to do, is to put, it’s obviously not that full presentation, not that you’re even close to that, but some of the key facts of why we’re doing this millage. Putting that in the paper, we have election day is three weeks from tomorrow, so we’re running short on time. People have started to turn in their absentee ballots, so people are starting to vote absentee. So that’s a concern is that we need to get this word out as quickly as possible. What does council think about that idea?

Wylie said so usually their deadline is Monday – Smith said for a Wednesday – Wylie said for a Wednesday, so the earliest we could get it in would be coming out next Wednesday, which is the 21^st. Smith said yeah. Wylie said and that’s less than two weeks, a little less than two weeks before the election. Smith said so, we could run it for two Wednesdays.

Smith said if you think, is the Oakland Press a better option, or both? Wylie said I don’t think the Oakland Press is. I think I’m the only one who subscribes to it anymore. (Avery made an unintelligible comment.) Wylie said OK, there’s two of us. Avery said does it still come out in paper form? Wylie said I don’t think – Avery said yes – Wylie said oh yeah, I’ve seen it at the store. Avery said OK. Wylie said I don’t think I can get it delivered to my house anymore. But Clarkston News, I think, goes out to everybody. Fisher said yeah. Avery said once a month, I think, doesn’t it? Fisher said yeah, once a week. Avery said yeah, I think it goes out once a week. Wylie said but the free one that goes out to everybody, that the township pays for. Avery said correct. Wylie said I don’t know. Fisher said well, that’s the township insert. Wylie said but they do pay for the paper. At least they used to. Avery said yeah, they do. I get it once a month. Quisenberry said I get it once a week. Wylie said but then you must pay for it. Quisenberry said no. Fisher said no, the Clarkston News. Wylie said I don’t get it. Fisher said yeah, once a week. (Unintelligible crosstalk about whether the Clarkston News comes every week.) Quisenberry said every Wednesday. Wylie said oh, do you get it every week? Oh. Avery said yeah. It used to be once a month. Wylie said oh, I didn’t know. Why am I still paying for it? Smith said you’re the one. Fisher said well, the question is, who are you paying? Wylie said well, then I think if everybody’s getting it, I, my choice is to put something out.

Avery said do we have any idea how much cost would be? Smith said it depends. You know, if you do a full-page ad, you know, I think that would be several hundred dollars, maybe seven or eight hundred dollars, a full-page ad. If you do a half-page, it’s probably more like three hundred, but I don’t, I’m just estimating on previous experience. Fisher said there’s a lot at stake. Smith said there is a lot at stake.

Casey said would it be worth it to do the full-page? Fisher said I’m sorry, I’m not a policymaker. Wylie said my only concern with doing a full-page would be great, but my only concern with doing a full-page is people would say, they need all this money. Why are they spending money on putting a full-page ad in the Clarkston News? Quisenberry said but they’ll say that whether it’s a full or a half. Avery said yeah, no matter what size we put in there, I suppose you’re going to complain about it. Someone might complain about it. I feel like you can get the information that you need to get out in a bullet point, and a half-page, do a half-page. I guess I’m OK with that. There’s no need to be that extravagant. It’s pretty straightforward, right? Smith said it is.

Smith said the one question that has come up a lot on social media is the second shoe to drop, right, is the reduction of the operating millage. If this were to pass, and I’ve always used it, every time I’ve referenced the offsetting reduction, I always refer to it as the anticipated offsetting reduction, because that won’t be known until we get to the May budget public hearing. That’s when we can determine whether (unintelligible). But if the 7-mill police and fire mill were to pass, we are anticipating, Greg [Coté, treasurer] and I have talked about this, and we’ve talked about it in finance committee meetings as well. I know we have. We’re anticipating the possibility of a 5.5 mill reduction. Stating that as a fact, as you point out, Fisher, it has to be very factual, that technically is not a fact. We won’t know that until we get to that budget public hearing. But we’re going on previous discussions, previous history on this, is that we set the millage rate in the budget public hearing based on the need. If the police and fire are removed from the general operating budget, then there won’t be that big of a need in the operational budget anymore. So, I think it’s safe to say we will not leave it at the same 11.4 mills it is today. We will do some sort of drop. I can’t say whether that’s a 5-mill, 5.5, 6 mill. I can’t say definitively, so – Fisher said you can’t say it because you have to have a public hearing on the budget before you can say give a specific number.

Avery said yeah. But therein lies the problem. People see that and they say, well, you know, they could raise our millage 2, 3, 4 mills. What’s stopping them from doing that? And there’s nothing. Fisher said yeah. Avery said so I – (interrupting Avery), Fisher said but I will say that in the resolution that the council passed that put this on the ballot, we did say that if the electors of the city approve the separate millage fund for police, fire, emergency services, the city will not need to burden city taxpayers with the full operational millage. Rather, subject to the public hearing, the city would reduce the amount of the levy under the operational millage. Wylie said we can put that as a quote right into the ad. Fisher said yeah, exactly. Exactly, yes. Wylie said that’s a good point. Fisher said yes.

Avery said people are too smart, though. I mean, come on. We’re talking about there’s an additional 7 mills is what they would be giving us, access to additional 7 mills, with no guarantee that we wouldn’t levy all 7 mills. That’s the problem, ultimately. Rodgers said not all. Avery said and that’s a tough one to get through. Rodgers said a year from now or two years from now. Avery said yeah. Right. Fisher said sure. Rodgers said that’s the hard part. Avery said so – (interrupting Avery), Rodgers said not that we would want to do that because we all live in this city. Avery said well, no, because we all live here. Rodgers said right.

Avery said when I bump into people and they ask me questions about it, that’s how I respond. I say, well, listen, if we vote to raise, you know, the tax burden, it’s on us, too. Rodgers said right. Avery said so we’re not that excited about that prospect. So, you know, but the plain language of the ballot proposal, you know, we can’t say what we’re going to do. The way it’s set up. So, I feel like that’s going to be a tough sell.

Wylie said anybody want to make a motion? Do we have to change these? We don’t have to change the agenda. Do we have to put a motion on? Actually, this would be a resolution. We’re talking about spending money. Fisher said you don’t need to change the agenda because it’s part of his report.

Wylie said OK, I’ll make a resolution that we use city funds to place a half-page ad in the Clarkston News stating the facts regarding the upcoming millage. Second, Avery.

Snith said so, one or two ads? Wylie said oh, I will amend that to two ads. One for, that comes out the next Wednesday and one the week after. So, one coming out October 14^th, and oh, no, I’m sorry. One coming out October 21st, one coming out October 28^th. Casey said you want to put in it’s for the police and fire. Wylie said the millage for the police and fire. Casey said yeah. Wylie said it would have to, the ad itself would be, say more than just the millage. Casey said yeah. Wylie said it would have to say, police, fire, and emergency services millage proposal in the actual wording of the ad. Casey said yeah.

Wylie said OK, discussion or comments from council members?

(To Fisher), Rodgers said I’m assuming you would look over it before I get (unintelligible). Fisher said sure, absolutely.

Wylie said discussion or comments or questions from the public?

Rodgers said well, it was very disappointing to see that, that turnout from the first meeting. Wylie said oh, yeah. Rogers said I mean, there was probably six people here and two of us, two of us were here from council. So don’t quote me on that number, but it was a small turnout. Wylie said it was a very small turnout. And so, I’ve seen the same comments on Facebook. And I think it’s really easy to go on Facebook and get behind a pen and a computer and write a whole bunch of stuff that we as council can’t answer. But I don’t know how to get all those people that are so concerned on social media and other places to actually physically come here and address those concerns. So, I don’t know if the newspaper is going to change it. Wylie said I’ve asked, I’ve asked Megan [Kelly, Clarkston News] to get in touch, and I haven’t heard anything from her. Actually, she asked, who else is running? You’re running, and Forte’s running. Avery said she sent a little questionnaire. Wylie said I just wrote about the millage. Avery said you did? Wylie said yeah. Avery said I don’t remember what I put down. I mean, it said – (interrupting Wylie), Rodgers said what about – (continuing),Wylie said what are your concerns, and I’m sorry. I said, this is my way to put it out there.

Jones said what about running ads on Facebook from the city or the village page? Avery said is that allowed? Wylie said I did it when I ran once for council. I put ads in. I think I paid $25 or $15. Fisher said like one member of council? Jones said no. I was, can the city run ads about the public hearing on Facebook? Fisher said oh. Wylie said oh, oh. Smith said just publicizing the public hearing. (Unintelligible comment.) Smith said information session. Jones said about the – Fisher said that’s factual. Yeah, sure. Jones said I was going to say, if you want to get people out there, if you’re, like, so pay for some ads about the public hearing session. Smith said is there a cost to that? Jones said no, there is a cost. It might be a little bit lower than the newspaper ads. Avery said yeah, it doesn’t. I don’t spend a lot of time on Facebook, but doesn’t it usually encompass the (unintelligible). Jones said You can specifically target – Avery said yeah – Fisher said a geographic area. Avery said yeah, I would think that would be.

Wylie said I haven’t seen that. So, there has been some. I haven’t seen anything on Facebook, but I haven’t been on much. But also, you know, who knows where these people live? I don’t know who they are. Jones said yeah, so that’s why you would do the ads. You can get the ad and target it to people that are actually within the village as opposed to the metro area, for lack of a better phrase. Smith said I don’t know how to do this so I rely on Guillen to do that if that’s something we would (unintelligible).

Wylie said any other discussion on the newspaper ad?

No comments.

Wylie said anybody else? Council or public?

No comments.

Wylie said OK, so we’ll need a roll call vote because it is a financial. We need, of course, OK, so I guess we probably ought to put a dollar amount on this resolution. Avery said not to exceed. Wylie said not to exceed. Avery said $1,000. Wylie said OK. For two weeks, yeah. Avery said yeah. Wylie said yeah, that’s good.

Wylie said now, is there any other discussion?

No comments.

(To Guillen), Wyiie said OK, we need a roll call.

Quisenberry, Jones, Casey, Avery, Rodgers, and Wylie voted yes.

Wylie said OK, so the resolution is adopted. Passed. And so, you guys will take care of that. Get in touch with the Clarkston News.

(To Fisher), Smith said I’ll get a draft put together and send it to you. Fisher said great. Wylie said thank you.

Smith said OK, so that was the first item and the most important. Hometown Heroes, if you weren’t aware that there was an event held here in the city hall on September 29th. Big turnout for that. This is our new veterans program. The banners are up. And we’re looking at the possibility, and I bring this to council before we do anything, of course, or spend any money. The possibility of doing a double bar through the light post so there could be banners, which in most cities is the case, there’s banners on both sides of the light post. So, you can double the number of veterans that you can acknowledge. So, I don’t know what the cost of that is, so we’d have to investigate that and bring it to a future council meeting.

Jones said I would just add that the banners look great. I think it’s awesome. I just don’t know. It’s not a revenue-driving thing, so it’s not a huge amount,  I know it would not be a huge amount of money to invest in the thing, but again, the next item on here is to reduce costs going forward. We’re going to roll something back, so I just don’t know if that’s going to be the best spend. Smith said yeah. Yeah, I’ll bring that to council, and we can weigh that decision at that time.

Rodgers said maybe that’s something that the Main Street Clarkston would be interested in. Smith said and getting behind, sure. Rodgers said yeah. Smith said yeah, that’s certainly a possibility. Rodgers said yeah, yeah. Maybe that’s what we need to do.

Smith said OK. Shred Day, we did do our last Shred Day. We’re looking at possibly scaling that back in next year, as Jones just mentioned, because it is a little costly if no one’s going to show up for it. So, we’re looking to scale that back. We never have no one show up. It’s just usually five or six people come in. Wylie said that’s pretty low.

Smith said Zoning Board of Appeals [ZBA], I let you know what’s been approved by the ZBA here. I won’t go into that, but I do want you to know that we have a couple of openings on ZBA. So, if you are aware of somebody that lives in the city, it is a requirement, I believe, that we would like some volunteers to fill those open seats on the ZBA. Wylie said is Anne [Clifton] already gone from the ZBA? Smith said this was her last meeting. Wylie said it was her last meeting, OK. Smith said she’s leaving in early October.

Smith said MML [Michigan Municipal League] conference, I attended that last week. It was, as always, a great conference. A lot of topics to cover. Of course, they have breakout sessions. You can’t attend all of them simultaneously, but there’s always some good information to be learned. Artificial intelligence, as you can imagine, was kind of a big topic this go around. A lot that can be done there. And a lot of protection that you should also be thinking about. So, I’m looking into that. Do we want to subscribe to, rather than use the public artificial intelligence tools? So that was some good knowledge gained there. Data centers, of course, I didn’t talk about that. It doesn’t apply to us. Housing shortfalls, not so much us either, but good discussion on strong cities and what strong cities have in common relative to housing. So that was a really good discussion. Health insurance costs rising. I was not able to get to that session, but I will access the information in the follow up communication that MML provides. Municipal burnout and civility were two big topics. A session that was held primarily for city workers, but also city council members, on health, safety of your health and your sanity. And it really was a standing moment in that. A lot of interest in what can you do to stay healthy mentally as you go through some of these interactions with residents and complainers. It’s really noticeable the number of people that spoke up about this. It was amazing. A lot going on in the municipalities. And we feel it here as well. A lot on Flock cameras. Of course, it doesn’t impact us, but it does, did come up quite a bit. And then there was an overview on legislative actions. Currently, I’m in the process. Not so much this conference. It’s usually the spring conference that I go to, the CapCon. That’s where you really get into a lot of legislative actions, current and future. They go into a lot more detail than they did in this one. But just a great overall session. I was glad I was there. Stayed from the beginning to the end. And it was just overall a good event. If you want more details on that, I’m happy to provide that. But yeah, that’s just a recap from last week.

Smith said and then last thing on the report is the curbing of storm drains. This is something that you approved, and I’m so glad that we did this. This is the kind of thing that I think we need to really watch going forward because this can get so expensive. With a fairly small investment, we can halt some of these erosion situations going on. So, I really try to watch for these. And as they come up, I’ll try to bring them to council and get them resolved so that we’re not having to pay excessive bills trying to repair things because they’ve been let go just too long.

Wylie said do you drive around yourself and check for this sort of stuff, or DPW [Department of Public Works], or all of the above? Smith said it’s both, yes. Jimi [Turner, DPW supervisor] brings a lot of these to my attention, and then I drive around as well, look for any kinds of things like this, as well as ordinance violations. So, we look for that at the same time.

Wylie said any questions or comments for the city manager on the city manager’s report? Council members?

No comments.

Wylie said the public?

Wylie recognized Chet Pardee for a comment.

(To Smith), Pardee said what was the cost to be able to repair? Smith said $822, they said it was all. Pardee said that’s really a low number. Wylie said that’s a really low number. They were there, I think, almost all day. Smith said yeah, I’m sure they were. Wylie said wow. OK. Smith said yeah. Pardee said and that was the concrete guy that did that? Smith said yes. Pardee said the little sidewalk replacement guy? Smith said no. Pardee said Oroczo. Smith said yeah, Oroczo. Yeah, they did that, and in that little drain, as shown in the picture, he built a sump below that so that mud and whatnot gets washed in there and can settle at the bottom. You have to clean it out periodically, starting initially, and then the water can continue to flow, but the sump catches the dirt. So, they did a wonderful job. Wylie said great.

Wylie said anybody else?

No comments.

Agenda Item #8 – Oakland County Sheriff’s Report for September (video time mark 0:27:54):

• • Cumulative Sheriff Report, September 2026 (page 6/51 of the council packet)

Wylie said Item #8 is Oakland County Sheriff’s Report for September, and that is included in our packet. Any questions or comments from council members? When’s he, I don’t know his name, when’s he coming again? Smith said so – (interrupting Smith), Wylie said I know you’re having a hard time getting him. Lieutenant Buchmann. Rodgers said maybe it would help with the costs. Smith said he works a lot of overtime shifts. During the summer it’s Pine Knob, so his availability is somewhat limited. But I have asked him, I asked him to come back in September, and I’ve asked him to come back in October, and he said all those dates he’s got (unintelligible). So, I’ll try to get him in November. Wylie said OK.

Wylie said anybody else?

Rodgers said well is there, like, another liaison that could come in his place? I mean, they’re not helping their cause here. Smith said right. He’s the sheriff [sic], and then the lieutenant above him is Lieutenant Buchmann. I have not had any luck getting Lieutenant Buchmann here. But I could ask. You can go below Sergeant Bowie, and then you can go below him (unintelligible). So, I think the sergeant is kind of the minimum level. Or go up to the lieutenant. Wylie said OK. Smith said I can ask Lieutenant Buchmann. Rodgers said it’s worth a try. Smith said yeah.

Wylie said anybody else in the public?

Wylie recognized Quisenberry for a comment.

Quisenberry said I just think it’s a shame that they set that up. That’s, that’s an excuse. That’s all I see that as is an excuse. Well, we can’t because, they can have somebody come here and answer questions about their providing service for us, whether it’s a deputy, whether it’s a sergeant or a lieutenant or whatever. And I don’t see any reason why they couldn’t have somebody here make an appearance for an hour at a meeting. It just makes no sense whatsoever. Rodgers said I mean, we can even change up the agenda to get them on first so that they can leave if they want to. Smith said and I think if we set the time that they just take notes, and if they don’t have all the answers, they go back and they bring to the following council meeting and come back with the answers. If they don’t, if they’re not engaged enough to know all the answers, if we’re open to that, I think that might open the door to a lower level. Wylie said I think that would be appropriate.

Wylie said anybody else?

Chet Pardee said just a question. Wylie recognized Pardee for a comment.

Pardee said community liaison line. Do you think that involves us or not? And it’s 111 for meetings, and then it’s a lot of zeros for other. And I would think that would be where they would take credit for coming to the council meeting. Avery said they’re fudging the number there. Smith said yeah. Quisenberry said but they aren’t coming, so why is there one? Pardee said we had the sergeant (unintelligible) here. (Unintelligible comment.) Pardee said July or August. Pardee said he wasn’t offering anything helpful. Wylie said we’ll give them the benefit of the doubt they’re doing something, especially since there’s a safety millage in Independence Township. But, yeah, it would be nice if they would come see us.

Wylie said anybody else?

No comments.

Agenda Item #9 – Consent Agenda (video time mark 0:31:24):

• • 09-14-2026, Final Minutes, Regular City Council Meeting (page 7/51 of the council packet)
  • 09-28-2026. Draft Minutes, Regular City Council Meeting (page 9/51 of the council packet)
  • 10-12-2026, Treasurer’s Report (page 11/51 of the council packet)
  • 10-09-2026, Check Disbursement Report, 09-01-2026 – 09-30-2026 (page 12/51 of the council packet)

Wylie said Item #9 is the consent agenda. This contains the final minutes of the September 14^th regular meeting, draft minutes of the September 28^th regular meeting, treasurer’s report for October 12, 2026. And I’ll need a motion and a second to accept the consent agenda.

Motion by Rodgers; second Quisenberry.

Wylie said any discussions or comments from council members?

No comment.

Wylie said from the public?

Wylie recognized Pardee for a comment.

Pardee said OK, I wish Greg [Coté] was here. He would probably be helpful. So, we’ve got several checks in here to Hutch. Wylie said can you tell us what page you’re talking about? Pardee said OK, so I’m looking at page 2. I’m looking at 2 of 7. So, Hutch Paving for $104,000. And then there are following lines that say Hutch for $55,000 and Hutch for $55,000. So, I got to $215,000. And then there’s an F&V [Fleis & VandenBrink, contract engineers] entry that’s the engineering firm for $74,000. So, I was just trying to understand what those were. I would imagine it’s got something to do with Church Street. (To Smith), Pardee said but I was thinking $104,000 and $55,000 were the numbers that you and I have had some dialogue about. That’s like $160,000 or something like that.

Smith said so, the way that the grant works is a 50-50 matching grant that we have from MDOT [Michigan Department of Transportation]. So, we alone pay Hutch. And then MDOT reimburses us. So, what you’re not seeing on this report is the income side of the equation. Pardee said OK. Smith said so they’re, Hutch, I’m sorry, MDOT is paying us for their half of the project. So that’s in the income statement. These are all outgoing checks. So, we are paying not only the city’s portion out on Hutch, but we’re also paying the MDOT portion. Now, the F&V engineering, what page was that on? Guillen said $7,000. It’s $7,000 on the front of the report. Pardee said 6? 4 of 7. 4 of 7 is the top. It says engineering services. And so, I’m not sure if you’ve got them working on Miller engineering or? Wylie said 4 of 7. Smith said no, they haven’t done any work on Miller. And that’s all East Church Street. Avery said right, and that’s $7,400. Not $74,000. Smith said yeah. (Unintelligible comments.)

Smith said and I must correct myself. When you were asking about what’s on the next page, it was Oroczo Concrete was $8,200. I said $820, I was off of there as well. So, the Oroczo repair of the new curb is $8,200. (Unintelligible comments.) Avery said OK. Wylie said that does make more sense.

Pardee said so, the other thing that’s on page 2 of 7 looks like payments to Independence Township. And I was just wondering, are those the usual monthly numbers accurate? And they say $43,000 for law enforcement and fire for 58. I was trying to get locked in my mind. PL, is this the number that we should be seeing every month going forward?

Smith said so, I have yet to receive a monthly bill from Independence Township. So, what I instructed Coté is we can’t fall behind. We will not fall behind. So, what he does have, because at the beginning of the year in January, they send us four quarterly bills right up front because they know what the amounts will be. So, they just send us all four bills, and we sit on them until they’re due. Well, the third quarter bill was due. And I said, let’s go ahead and pay that, even though we know we are underpaying because the new monthly algorithm is slightly higher. Let’s go ahead. I want you to pay this. And then at some point, we’re going to have to do reconciliation with Independence Township, quarterly versus monthly billing, and get caught up. So, this is a quarterly bill for police and fire for Q3. Quisenberry said it’s based on the wrong algorithm. Smith said correct. But I didn’t want to not pay it. Pardee said OK, but it’s a quarterly bill, not a monthly bill. Smith said it’s a quarterly bill.

Avery said don’t we know what the number is supposed to be? Smith said well, it’s 2.7% of what their bill is. I think I can kind of extrapolate what their bill should be, but I don’t know the exact amount – Avery said I understand – (continuing), Smith said of what the county’s billed them, so – Quisenberry said I thought we got a copy of their bill from the sheriff’s, the county. Smith said we did, but it wasn’t, that was their estimate at the start of the year. It wasn’t the final.

Rodgers said why are they not billing you? What’s they’re like, when you asked them, what did they say? Smith said I don’t know. They did send us, their accounting person did send us a reconciliation saying that when we go to these monthly bills, here’s the difference. And they did it all the way back to the start of the year. I guess it was for the first six months of the year, a comparison of what we should have been billed under monthly and what we were actually billed under quarterly. They did that reconciliation. They know the numbers, but they aren’t sending me an invoice. Rodgers said it just doesn’t make any sense. It’s like 2026. You can put it in the computer and send it off. Quisenberry said it also doesn’t make sense because what you just said conflicts with what you said about a minute ago. About 2.7% of their bill, if they know what those numbers are and they sent us a bill for it, then we know what the cost of their contract is. Smith said no, they haven’t sent me a bill for a monthly bill. I don’t know what their, the bill that they get from the Oakland County Sheriff, that’s the missing piece of information I don’t know.

Avery said right, and in Smith’s defense, I don’t know that we should rely on the township’s figuring. Rodgers said yeah, right. Quisenberry said but that’s why I thought we had a hard copy of what the contract was with the county and Independence and what the bottom dollar amount was on it. Avery said yeah, apparently, we don’t. Smith said we’ve used that for estimating purposes, but do I want to pay that as an invoice? You know, Coté will say and Rana [Emmons, contract auditor] will say, you pay from invoices, and those invoices go in our filing cabinet, and we can validate that we paid the amount that was requested. I haven’t received a monthly invoice. Avery said even though that’s what the contract says, it should be happening.

(To Pardee), Wylie said you got something else? No, I just –

Wylie said OK, anybody else?

No comments.

Wylie said let’s see, OK, so we had Rodgers with a motion, Quisenberry seconded to accept the consent agenda.

Motion to accept the consent agenda passed by unanimous voice vote.

Wylie said the consent agenda is accepted.

Agenda Item #10, Unfinished Business (video time mark 0:39:35):

Item #10a – Discussion: Rental Housing Inspection Program (Independence Township Example) (video time mark 0:39:39):

• • Independence Township, Rental Inspection Program (page 19/51 of the council packet)
  • Independence Township, Rental Housing, General Property Maintenance Checklist (page 20/51 of the council packet)
  • Rental House Certification Fee Schedule (page 21/51 of the council packet)
  • Independence Township, Ordinance 2025-10-001, Rental Housing (page 22/51 of the council packet)

Wylie said Item #10 is unfinished business. Discussion of Rental Housing Inspection Program, Independence Township examples included in the packet.

Smith said I know you talked about this two weeks ago in my absence, and I guess the next question is, do I bring this forward in the form of a resolution? But before you answer, I have a call in to Dave Moran from the township because to have the township add this to our contract would be a contractual change. And so, when I approached Moran, and I copied you, Fisher, on that email, the first thing he says, I’ve got to talk to Chuck [Phyle, Independence Township Supervisor] about this. So, I just talked to him an hour ago, and he said, I’m going to try to get in to Phyle tomorrow and talk to him about this. He says, I don’t know what his position on this. I said, well, we’ll wait to hear from you. If this is something, we’d love to piggyback on your program because it’s a successful program, it’s being done well, and it aligns with our building inspection program, we’d love to piggyback on it, but if it wasn’t meant to be, well, we can always, if council wants to move forward with this, we can always find an inspector of our own.

Wylie said when you say it calls for a contractual change, you’re talking about adding another contract with Independence Township. Smith said or adding another service – Wylie said another service – (continuing) Smith said under our existing building services agreement. Wylie said oh, okay. Smith said our current building service covers permitting, inspections, and coding. Wylie said OK. Smith said those are the three kind of things our current contract covers. This would be a fourth item. Wylie said OK.

Wylie said one question we had last time we talked about it was there were some concerns, and this was, we wanted to get your opinion on this. There was some discussion that some people thought that the city has to do this, that if we don’t do this, that we are putting ourselves at risk, that we don’t have inspection for our rental houses. Fisher said I don’t believe that. I don’t agree with that.

Rodgers said why would we want to do it from a legal standpoint? Why do we want this? Fisher said well, I guess the question is, is this a service that advances the public health, safety, and welfare? And if it is, then that would be one reason to do it. But you know, there are reasons to be careful with it, too, because when the original, there was a case from 1970 that originally created something called the implied warranty of habitability, which gives tenants the right to withhold rent and to insist upon the building being, the rental premises being habitable. And there were, like, three cases, like a trio of cases that were there. And one of the judges who voted for this concept and established it in 1970 said, but be careful what you ask for here, because if you are too hard on these landlords, because the landlord’s not going to pay this. The landlord’s going to pass this on, and the tenant, they may lose tenants. And so, the question is, if a landlord is pressed too hard with this, they’ll stop leasing, stop renting, and sell it. And then that will be a good, affordable house that is no longer available. So, that’s one thing to be concerned about. You know, just take that into consideration, keep it in your mind when you think about this. I’m not saying don’t do this.

Wylie said is there any, have you ever heard of any examples of that happening? Where the fees were so much that – Fisher said oh, yeah. Wylie said you have. Fisher said oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, and you know, what happens in, like, New York is that not only do they create these kinds of things, but they put a rent control on, so they can’t raise the rent. So, they’re imposing these obligations on the landlord and not allowing them to recover the cost. So that’s where you really see this turning and running out of the rental business.

(To Fisher), Smith said Moran told me that they famously stole this wording from Waterford Township. And they said that you actually wrote this for Waterford Township back in the day. I don’t know how long ago that was. So he said, by default, you’re kind of getting Fisher’s. Fisher said and paying for it. There’s something wrong with that.

Wylie said so, one of my concerns is, we’re talking about, if we do it with Independence Township, we’re talking about having more contractual obligations, relationship with Independence Township. And so far, there’s some things that go very well, and others, as we see in our next item, I mean, there’s issues with that. So, I’m a little concerned about that. And I also really don’t like the idea of doing it on our own. I think that’s a big burden for a very, very small city staff to take care of. Smith said yes, Moran has said that it’s a big burden for them. Wylie said I’m sure it is. Smith said on taking on about, I think it was 6,000? Wylie said you told us a number. It’s a huge number. Smith said of, you know, that’s apartments. So, all the apartments adding up, and then homes as well. And so, what they’re embarking on is trying to get in this three-year cadence so that every year, one-third of the units have to be re-inspected. So, they’re starting out on this. And he can see the day that they’ll get everybody, you know, get their first inspection in. But he says it’s a big task. They hired a full-time manager and a full-time inspector.

Fisher said is it self-sustaining? Do you know? Smith said the whole idea is it’s supposed to be self-sustaining. No out-of-pocket, but no profit either. Fisher said right. Oh, you can’t have profit, right. Smith said no, so it’s just breaking even issue.

Wylie said and the other concern is Mr. [David] Delasko and other people who lived in those apartments off Holcomb, they had issues with their apartments and the safety and well-being, and that was a big concern. Their landlord was not maintaining good, safe facilities. Smith said but then Fisher’s point is that, you know, would David be subject to a rent raise? You know, (unintelligible) did this.

Avery said well, I mean, yes, but we got to hold people accountable sometimes. You know, and sometimes, yes, the small guy gets squeezed. But in a lot of cases, this will do overall more good that at least you put the landlord on notice that if he continues to operate that way, he’s going to get into trouble. Maybe he straightens his act out. But you can’t be afraid. You can’t govern from fear. I mean, the idea is to do right by our residents. I mean, it would be great. I mean, my memory serves, he made phone calls, there were meetings with him, and he still wasn’t really responding to it. So, I guess my question is can we at least put something on the books that require rental, certain rental standards without having to hire someone yet, to see if we can get some voluntary compliance, and if they’re not complying, then we can go to the next step. Because it’s hard to go to someone and say, unless there’s something already on the books, right, to say, hey, you’re not doing this up to code. Well, if there’s no code, then everybody is, how do you hold them accountable for a standard that doesn’t exist?

Fisher said well, you know that there is that concept of the implied warranty of habitability. That’s now in Michigan statute. And I’m wondering if we could make contact with, there are lawyers that work for government entities and other associations that take these cases, either for free or for very, probably the judge would pay them the money for the case if we could find – Avery said for low income people – (continuing), Fisher said them and have them take the ball for a period of time. (Avery made an unintelligible comment.)

Wylie said I’m trying to think where the, I’m looking at the fees at Independence Township. So, like, so for a multifamily building, which is three or more units, that’s $150 registration. This is what Independence Township charges. $150 registration, so I assume that’s a one-time registration for a current owner. And then $150, oh, I’m sorry, $120. Wow. Multifamily inspection, each building exterior and grounds is $120, and then $80 for each dwelling unit. Oh, so that does add up. And that would be once every three years. So about $200. OK.

Smith said he said that they have a kind of a loyalty program, or whatever you call it, that awards them a free year if they’ve been on good behavior and they’re doing things properly. Wylie laughed and said I don’t know if that’s the right phrase. Smith said maybe it’s the wrong phrase, but they can extend it from two years to three years, so.

Smith said OK, well, I think I need to first find out from Moran whether this is even an option. If Phyle balks at it or not, then I think we need to move forward. Wylie said I think that’s, we need to find that out. Smith said so, I’ll keep you posted on that. Wylie said OK.

Wylie said did anybody else have anything else to say on this rental housing inspection?

Wylie recognized Pardee for a comment.

Pardee said so, I sense with what council has on their plate right now, I don’t see that this makes the top 50 list. And I think it would be helpful if council and Smith got together and said, OK, what are the top ten things that we ought to be working on, and they exist, rather than trying to add something to the platter. So that’s my point. Wylie said good point. Pardee said I don’t think we need that on your platter in our current situation.

Avery said well, we really can’t have that meeting unless it’s a public meeting. So, right, that’s why it’s called a city council meeting. So, we have these meetings every two weeks. That’s what we have to discuss. I mean, right? Pardee said yeah. But my sense was that why we got interested two weeks ago was that we thought there was some liability that we were going to have if we didn’t do something. I’m hearing something different than that right now. And I don’t think we have a problem, I don’t think we have a problem in this area that needs the attention of the city. Avery said well, I tend to agree with you. Pardee said and the city council – (interrupting Pardee), Avery said I don’t think it’s a widespread problem. We’re not getting a lot of complaints that rental properties in the village are in disrepair or people are not being treated fairly. I guess if we had a lot of people coming, it would be a different discussion. (To Pardee) Wylie said it’s a good point, though. Pardee said thank you.

Agenda Item #11, New Business (video time mark 0:51:55):

Item #11a – Resolution: Reapproval of the Intergovernmental Agreement for Police Services (video time mark 0:51:56)

• • Resolution – Reapproval of the Intergovernmental Agreement for Police Services (page 35/51 of the council packet)
  • Intergovernmental Law Enforcement Services Agreement, signed by Jonathan Smith 06-23-2025 (page 36/51 of the council packet)
  • Intergovernmental Law Enforcement Services Agreement, signed by Chuck Phyle 07-22-2025 (page 36/51 of the council packet)

Wylie said Item #11 is new business, Resolution of Reapproval of the Intergovernmental Agreement for Public Services.

(Wylie read the resolution.)

Wylie said now I need somebody to resolve and support.

Resolution by Avery; second Jones.

Wylie said discussion and comments from council members.

No comments.

Wylie said from the public. And then we need, I’m sorry. Pardee said I have a question.

Wylie recognized Pardee for a comment.

Pardee said so, when the sergeant was here, he said I should have 8 deputies, and I have 3, and then the conversation we’ve had with Quisenberry, it’s not really clear if that’s per day or per shift, but so maybe we’re shy 5 or maybe we’re shy 15, but I find it really puzzling that we’re deep into this thing and we really don’t know what are the dollars that the county is asking Independence Township to pay. Are they asking? And then Independence Township is asking us to pay. Are we paying for people that aren’t on the roll? That’s really what my question is, and I don’t think that we, nor without a knowledge of Independence Township, have dived into understanding are we paying for people that aren’t costing anything. And trying to use 3 deputies to cover 5 others with overtime isn’t healthy.

Quisenberry said well, he did say that. He said we have a contract. We’re obligated to provide whatever it was, 8, I’m not sure, and he says we don’t have it. But then he said we then backfill with overtime. So, the coverage is being covered, but at a higher rate. The deputies are getting paid higher per that day because they’re on overtime. So, he did say that. (To Pardee), Quisenberry said and he also said if you look in the contract, it’s hard for us and you, to sit there and say we need 3 deputies in here. Nowhere in the contract does it say the City of Clarkston will always have 1, 2, or 3 assigned in your area. Pardee said I agree. They’re going to provide services township-wide, and when a call for service comes in within the city, they will then handle it. So as far as trying to figure out what we should be paying the township based upon how many deputies are working per shift is academic. We pay the township 2.7% of a figure every month regardless of how many people are patrolling our city or the township. And we were told that the agreement that the township signed and therefore then passed on to us is that that number of deputies will remain in effect whether we have to pay overtime or not. So, I guess I’m trying to figure out your concern about are we paying for more deputies than we need. I don’t know how you’re going to say that because we don’t have a hard number of how many deputies are going to be in our square mile. (Pardee made an unintelligible comment during Quisenberry’s response.)

Pardee said OK, and I’m not asking about the deputies in Clarkston. I’m asking how many deputies is the sheriff asking the Independence Township to pay for that then gets passed on to us? Quisenberry said that gets used as a basis in the figure to charge us. Pardee said they’re 10 budgeted and there are 3 available and I don’t see how those 3 people can cover the other 5 people’s overtime on a physical basis. But I guess you’re saying, OK, we’re paying 2.7 and I’ll accept that we’re paying 2.7 but I think it’s a horrible thing, horrible thing for us not to know what drives the 2.7. Quisenberry said we know, well, you’re right, we should know that and there was a contract that we saw a while ago that had a personnel breakdown for Independence Township. They’re paying for a lieutenant, so many sergeants, some deputy ones, some deputy twos, clerks, all this sort. There was a breakdown that was in that contract of what Independence Township, what level of service and personnel assigned to this contract was. That was in there.

Pardee said and do we understand what it meant? Quisenberry said well, of course we do. Pardee said I’m way back here, OK. I’m wondering whether or not the county is asking Independence Township to pay for people who aren’t on, aren’t hired. And I guess that’s really – (interrupting Pardee), Quisenberry said that aren’t hired – (continuing), Pardee said part of the township question, OK. But then we’re saying, okay, we’ll take our 2.7% and we’ll take our $300 per month and we’ll pay it.

Quisenberry said I think here’s the issue. The township has agreed to pay the county so much, figure a million dollars. No, it’s going to be more than that, but just a million dollars. And they said, and this is what we will provide for you. Now all of a sudden, because of personnel shortages and whatever scheduling, they have to supplement that coverage using 30% more overtime, which is another time and a half. That is then made up with by the county. They don’t then turn around and bill the township saying because you used, we couldn’t provide you the services so you used overtime with it. No, the county needs that. That’s the same way they do, with in the jail. You’d be amazed at what these turnkeys in the jail make, double their salary because of overtime. But the fact, I don’t think there’s anything in the contract between the county and Independence that says you guys are responsible for the overtime that is generated by filling this number. Fisher said I’m sure we’d hear about that. Quisenberry said yeah, because if that was, it would be passed on, it would be part of the 2.7.

Pardee said no, I think we’re all paying for 10, and then there are deputies, 3, who try to fill in with overtime. I don’t think it’s possible for 3 deputies on overtime basis to cover the other 5. Wylie said I don’t think they’re saying it’s just those 3. They can get, and by the way, Quisenberry, you’re giving an excellent explanation for this. I think any deputy, perhaps, potentially, could be doing overtime on that shift. Maybe the guy who just left the morning shift fills his overtime in the afternoon, or the guy who was there, or the lady who was there the day before does it. It’s not just those 3. Avery said right. Wylie said I think he’s saying 3 people who are assigned for that shift show up. We fill in the other slots with overtime. Quisenberry said and you’re still getting a body for a body. It’s just one of them is costing time and a half.

(To Pardee), Jones said are you asking if we’re paying for 10 salaries regardless, if it’s 5 people doing it? Paree said yeah, or 3 people are doing it. Quisenberry said I don’t even know where those numbers came from. Pardee said 10? Quisenberry said yeah. Pardee said he, Sergeant Foley (spelling not provided)? Smith said Bowie (spelling not provided)? Pardee said Sergeant Foley? Smith said Sergeant Bowie. Pardee said Sergeant Bowie, OK. He said, I’ve got 3 deputies to apply, and I’m supposed to have 10. That’s where I heard 10 and 3.

Quisenberry said see, here’s my mind thinking, all right? I was extremely disappointed in 95% of what he had to say, OK? And if he’s saying, I have 3 deputies, does that mean that he has 3 deputies per shift, say, working the day shift? Eight to four, I have 3 deputies, all right? In the afternoon shift, he might have 5 deputies. In midnights, he might have 2. So, I don’t know what he means when he’s saying, I have 3 to work with, all right? What we do know is that the agreement says that this cadre of sheriff’s deputies from the, it’s the substation commander is a lieutenant here. In other places, it’s a captain. This is our cadre that we have. All of these people are going to provide. This is what we think we need to have to provide coverage here. And if they think they need more, then they’ll add another D1 or D2 or something so. But they’ve agreed on a certain number, and that number, whatever it costs Independence for that cadre, we pay 2.7% of it. (To Quisenberry), Wylie and Pardee said thank you for responding.

(An unidentified man) made a comment to Quisenberry. Who pays for the overtime? In your example, it’s $1 million, OK? But that’s with slots that are totally filled. Quisenberry said great question. The unidentified man said half the slots aren’t filled, so they have to pay $1.1 million. Quisenberry said yes. The unidentified man said does the county absorb the $100,000? Quisenberry said yes, they do, because it’s baked into their budget as a line-item overtime cost. What are we going to pay? What are we going to budget for our overtime expenses for this year that’s above and beyond these contracts and stuff? And that overtime consists of Marine Division going out and doing stuff, or, as I said, the jail deputies that are forced to work extra hours and stuff like that. So, there is a line item in the Sheriff’s budget for overtime, and that would all come out of there, unless – (interrupting Quisenberry, the unidentified man said so, Independence or the city, is not responsible for the overtime? Quisenberry said unless there is a clause in the contract between the Sheriff’s Department and Independence that says you will also be billed for a percentage of anticipated overtime. If there’s a line item in that budget, which I saw that page that said everything from the lieutenant down to the clerks and whatever, unless there’s a line item in that expense page that says overtime, expected overtime, then it could come out of there. But that line item is part of the bottom line, and all we’re paying on is the bottom line, so.

Avery said our number is not moving, as I understand it. It’s set. The problem we have is knowing what that set number is. So if they’re paying 10x in overtime, that doesn’t affect the 2.7% that we’re paying.

Jones said because the last packet of this that was, that came through had the breakdown, the full breakdown, and it’s basically what it was saying, if I was understanding it correctly, is that the Independence substation can be staffed by up to, like they’re budgeted for x amount of men. However, they do not have that many men currently available to them. And so, they are taking what they have and doing what they can. Quisenberry said as a matter of practice, the Sheriff’s Department uses overtime quite a bit to offset what is expected. But that’s, as I said, baked into the cost. And the reason why they do that is they found that it’s cheaper to pay overtime to a certain extent than it is to bring on a full-time FTE [full-time equivalent]. So, they will use overtime to fill vacancies up until a point where they realize, no, we need to actually get bodies in here.

Rodgers said and it’s cheaper because of the benefits and all – Quisenberry said exactly – (continuing), Rodgers said that they have to pay the full-time person. It’s very similar to nurses in the hospital. Quisenberry said yeah, exactly. Rodgers said there’s a service that you have to provide, and there might be 20 patients, and it should take, you know, 5 nurses to do it, but you know what? There’s a nursing shortage, and we can’t get 5 nurses, so we only have 4. And that 1 might have to stay over for another hour or two or a whole other shift. So, it’s not like the body, it’s not like a widget that you have to have X number. You have to provide that service. And however you can mesh those people, that’s how that service is provided, sometimes to the detriment of appropriate coverage. Is that kind of what you’re talking about? Quisenberry said there’s some similarities – Rodgers said kind of – Quisenberry but there’s obviously labor contracts that spell – Rodgers said yes – (continuing), Quisenberry said how many nurses per patient and all that that they have to contend with and stuff.

The unidentified man said but again, in the example, the contract is $1 million, and that includes some overtime. Quisenberry said possibly, if that’s a line I’m in with. The unidentified man said but, you know, they have open slots above and beyond, so that number becomes $1.1 million. And that $100,000 is not passed down to Independence nor the village. Quisenberry said no, because we’ve signed a contract for that bottom line. And if they’ve incurred more because of overtime, then I don’t know, I don’t know if it’s included in the contract with Independence or if it is coming out of the Sheriff’s Department’s, their main budget for their personnel with a big, huge dollar amount that they line item in for overtime costs.

The unidentified man said why is there such confusion of what the dollar amount? That should be just a fixed dollar amount. Quisenberry said that is the big question. Why don’t we know what that number is?

Wylie said it’s somewhat unrelated, but you might know. I think Lake Orion Township has taken the county to court over the failure to be open and transparent with where all the costs are coming from. Quisenberry said yeah, they sued their board of commissioners and Dave Woodward to get that information. Wylie said I don’t know where it stands right now. Fisher said and why wouldn’t they just come clean and give them the information? Wylie said and this would have started probably last winter, six, nine months ago. So, we’re not the only ones who have these questions. Pardee said that’s not Dave Woodward’s. Fisher said yeah, right. I got it. Pardee said he doesn’t do that. Fisher said I got it.

Wylie said any other questions or discussions from anybody?

Pardee said thank you.

Wylie said OK, we had a resolve from Avery and supported by Jones. And we need a roll call vote, please.

Casey, Jones, Avery, Rodgers, and Wylie voted yes.

Quisenberry voted no.

Wylie said and we have Forte was absent.

Quisenberry said if I just explain my no.

Wylie said hang on, the resolution is adopted.

Quisenberry said I would say, the only reason I’m saying no is because I think a dollar amount should be in here. And it isn’t. Avery said well, the formula’s in there. At the time that this was originally drafted, I’m assuming they did not know the bottom-line number. That’s why it’s not in there. I would agree that in future negotiations or whatever, that we’re maybe provided with that number before we approve (unintelligible).

Agenda Item #12, Adjourn Meeting (video time mark 1:10:14):

Wylie said Item #12, adjourn the meeting. I need a motion to adjourn.

Motion by Jones, second Wylie.

(No discussion offered.)

Motion to adjourn passed by unanimous voice vote.

Wylie said we are adjourned at 8:10. Thank you very much. Some interesting discussions, everybody.

Resources:

• • Link to video recording here
  • 10-12-2026 – city council packet